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Chaga Mushroom Bee-tea against pesticide poisoning

 
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Che Guebuddha
Golden Bee


Joined: 31 Jan 2012
Posts: 1549
Location: Hårlev, Stevns Kommune, Denmark

PostPosted: Sun Nov 30, 2014 5:08 pm    Post subject: Chaga Mushroom Bee-tea against pesticide poisoning Reply with quote

I listened to Paul Stamets on you tube talking about the benefits of Chaga mushrooms against Varroa virus and pesticide poisoning in honeybees and thought to try it out next year. I ordered a some on ebay. It would be great if this Chaga tea fed with sugar syrup could help the bees cope with pesticides.

Do you know of any one trying this before? All links and comments welcome.


Last edited by Che Guebuddha on Sun Nov 30, 2014 11:21 pm; edited 1 time in total
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catchercradle
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Joined: 31 May 2010
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Location: Cambridge, UK

PostPosted: Sun Nov 30, 2014 7:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have his book, "Mycelium Running which I love. It is one of the texts that I would advise anyone studying permaculture to read. Afraid I know nothing about the particular fungus you mention though.
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Che Guebuddha
Golden Bee


Joined: 31 Jan 2012
Posts: 1549
Location: Hårlev, Stevns Kommune, Denmark

PostPosted: Sun Nov 30, 2014 11:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

On his web page there is mention of a new product called "Host Defense Mushrooms Bee Friendly" which is made from this Chaga mushroom mycelium extract. Its still in the research state but worth testing.
http://www.fungi.com/beefriendly.html

My apiary is situated in a very harsh conventional mono-crop environment and my ladies sure need some help in form of a detox. My Chaga chunks order has dispatched today and I plan to drink it myself since we are also exposed to all sorts of agri-poisons here. I cant find any info if Chaga grows on birch trees in Denmark but in Sweden there should be some. Its not that cheap on ebay I must say. Would be great to find some in the near by forests.

I will most definitely try and feed my ladies this tea but not sure when is the best time to do so because i don't want sugar syrup in my honey Smile

Does any one have an idea what would be the best way to feed this tea to the bees?

I could also just brew the Chaga and then place it in a pot once cold near the hives and let the bees drink it as water.
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biobee
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Joined: 14 Jun 2007
Posts: 1051
Location: UK, England, S. Devon

PostPosted: Mon Dec 01, 2014 11:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is perfect vindication of the eco-floor, filled with decomposing wood chips!
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Lacewing
Guard Bee


Joined: 08 Sep 2012
Posts: 96
Location: Powys, Mid Wales

PostPosted: Mon Dec 01, 2014 12:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Very interested to read this - someone's just given me some chaga collected from forest in (?) Angermanland, in Sweden.
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Che Guebuddha
Golden Bee


Joined: 31 Jan 2012
Posts: 1549
Location: Hårlev, Stevns Kommune, Denmark

PostPosted: Mon Dec 01, 2014 1:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Phil Can you see mushroom/mycelium activity in the Eco-floor?
Also, is the Eco floor material moist in an occupied hive?

I now have a 400 square meters wood chip kit.che.n garden and i can see many mushrooms starting to grow Smile According to Stamets mycelium can biodegrade soil bound pesticides Smile My plan is to cover at least 1000 square meters with wood chips by the end of 2016.
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biobee
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Joined: 14 Jun 2007
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Location: UK, England, S. Devon

PostPosted: Mon Dec 01, 2014 7:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

As currently constructed, the floor does seem to have a tendency to dry out too much during the summer. I think a membrane of some kind between the filling material and the mesh may be the answer, or possibly mixing in some more moist material when filling it, but more experiments are needed.
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Adam Rose
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Joined: 09 Oct 2011
Posts: 582
Location: Manchester, UK

PostPosted: Tue Dec 02, 2014 11:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was also going to say that the deep floor is quite dry in the one hive where I have a deep floor. I think this is because of the gap between the deep floor attachment and the hive itself. I don't think it has to be a very big gap to allow the moisture out.

One reason to make the deep floor a separate component of the hive is to allow its replacement when it rots. But if there's any kind of gap between it and the main hive body, it's not going to be wet enough to rot any faster or slower than the rest of the hive. Perhaps I could seal the gap with some kind of tape ...

Another thing that might keep the moisture in is to make the bottom of the deep floor attachment water proof, rather than having a wide mesh which allows the water out.
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biobee
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Joined: 14 Jun 2007
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Location: UK, England, S. Devon

PostPosted: Tue Dec 02, 2014 12:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Adam Rose wrote:


Another thing that might keep the moisture in is to make the bottom of the deep floor attachment water proof, rather than having a wide mesh which allows the water out.


That's what I meant - some kind of semi-permeable membrane, that sits on the mesh and slows down the rate of evaporation/air penetration. I'm thinking that horticultural weed-suppressant cloth may work.
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Barbara
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Location: England/Co.Durham/Ebchester

PostPosted: Tue Dec 02, 2014 3:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I folded a sheet of newspaper up and put that in the bottom of the deep litter box on top of the mesh as I was concerned that the mesh size being 1/4 inch might allow wasps in and perhaps some of the medium to fall out. I put wood chip in that was already breaking down and showing signs of supporting mycelium growth but the top surface of it appears to be relatively dry. That said, the colony in that hive were a shook swarm suffering from DWV in August and they have shown no real intent to thrive and sadly, I'm pretty sure they won't make it through winter.

I can't say what type of mycelium was taking hold but you could see the white root systems forming on the damp wood chip when I put them into the box.
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Adam Rose
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Joined: 09 Oct 2011
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Location: Manchester, UK

PostPosted: Tue Dec 02, 2014 3:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

biobee wrote:

That's what I meant - some kind of semi-permeable membrane, that sits on the mesh and slows down the rate of evaporation/air penetration. I'm thinking that horticultural weed-suppressant cloth may work.


Ah - I see. I didn't read carefully enough.

Why semi permeable though ? Why not solid wood, maybe with an overflow hole on each end, like you have on a bath tub ? And then tape right along the join between the deep floor and the main part of the hive. If you're worried about rot, then maybe some pond liner.
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Che Guebuddha
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Joined: 31 Jan 2012
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Location: Hårlev, Stevns Kommune, Denmark

PostPosted: Tue Dec 02, 2014 6:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I dont think one can grow Chaga mushrooms in the deep floor. It grows only on Birch trees as a parasite mushroom.
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biobee
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Joined: 14 Jun 2007
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Location: UK, England, S. Devon

PostPosted: Wed Dec 03, 2014 2:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Adam Rose wrote:


Why semi permeable though ? Why not solid wood, maybe with an overflow hole on each end, like you have on a bath tub ? And then tape right along the join between the deep floor and the main part of the hive. If you're worried about rot, then maybe some pond liner.


Sure, why not - as long as there is drainage, it should be ok.
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biobee
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Joined: 14 Jun 2007
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Location: UK, England, S. Devon

PostPosted: Wed Dec 03, 2014 2:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Che Guebuddha wrote:
I dont think one can grow Chaga mushrooms in the deep floor. It grows only on Birch trees as a parasite mushroom.


I'm hoping that this is not the only fungus to have an action like this!
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Che Guebuddha
Golden Bee


Joined: 31 Jan 2012
Posts: 1549
Location: Hårlev, Stevns Kommune, Denmark

PostPosted: Wed Dec 03, 2014 2:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Im afraid Hope is a bit of a luxury for my bees in this pesticide laden environment Smile I must find a sure way to detox them and Chaga seems to be doing just that. As mentioned I do have a wood chip garden only 200 meters away from the apiary and I'm sure the bees will be able to feed on various mycelium extracts there if they need it.
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Manuel Robert
Guard Bee


Joined: 04 Dec 2011
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Location: Bischofsheim, Rhön , Germany

PostPosted: Thu Dec 04, 2014 8:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I can only recommend Paul Stamets book " Mycelium Running " already mentioned above, with great descriptions of methods to detoxificate landscape with the help of mushrooms, which mushroom to use for what toxin ect. Oyster mushroom on straw or woodchips is often used.
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HowieNZ
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Joined: 18 May 2014
Posts: 33
Location: Dunedin, New Zealand

PostPosted: Thu Dec 04, 2014 9:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here is the link to the Paul Stamets You Tube video How Mushrooms can save our bees https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DAw_Zzge49c
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Che Guebuddha
Golden Bee


Joined: 31 Jan 2012
Posts: 1549
Location: Hårlev, Stevns Kommune, Denmark

PostPosted: Thu Dec 04, 2014 10:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just received my batch of Chaga tea chunks and made a tea. It actually taste quiet nice Smile Will drink one glass of it daily and see what happens. I also ordered a book called "Chaga - King of the Medicinal Mushrooms" by David Wolfe. It will arrive soon and I hope to find some more info on this Mushroom. It might give the idea how to make a bee tea from it.

The Chaga I ordered comes from Russia and in the instructions it sais to drink it with some honey Smile Coincidence maybe Wink
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zaunreiter
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Joined: 26 Nov 2007
Posts: 3097
Location: Germany, NorthWest

PostPosted: Fri Dec 05, 2014 6:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

A word of warning here.
On the one hand the fungi is supposed to bind and thus deactivate pesticides and heavy metals for example, on the other you're eating it?

Depending on where the mushrooms came from in Russia there is the risk of nuclear contamination. After Tschernobyl there are parts in Germany where it officially is not recommended to eat wild mushrooms (and wild pork) because of this. Also it is well known, that many industrial countries got rid of their nuclear waste by sending it to Siberia where the drums with nuclear waste are simply dropped to the ground under the open sky in the Taiga.

So better get it tested before your consumption. With food from outside my own garden I am very sceptic, and for a very good reason! Whenever I tested it, I got disappointed. It is neither funny nor to be taken lightly to eat contaminated food.

Better grow you own and test even that. (Living next to an old industrial region, there are many heavy metals in my soil.)
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Che Guebuddha
Golden Bee


Joined: 31 Jan 2012
Posts: 1549
Location: Hårlev, Stevns Kommune, Denmark

PostPosted: Fri Dec 05, 2014 9:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sadly that is possible. The Chaga I bought is from a registered company selling other sorts of teas and extracts and it said on the package that it passed radiation control. It doesn't mention heavy metals or pesticides though. I think I should travel to Sweden and collect some myself
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beelovedflowers
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Joined: 05 Dec 2014
Posts: 1
Location: Wellington

PostPosted: Fri Dec 05, 2014 10:10 am    Post subject: Environmental issues, GM, pesticides and campaigning Reply with quote

I've started using wool biomats from Biogrow in my garden and perhaps they'd be useful if you're looking for a semipermeable mat? I guess because we have so many sheep in NZ, we use wool for all kinds of things like insulation and I think as a mat it may work for the purposes you discuss here. I buy it in rolls and it cuts easily.
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biobee
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Joined: 14 Jun 2007
Posts: 1051
Location: UK, England, S. Devon

PostPosted: Fri Dec 05, 2014 2:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Barbara wrote:
I folded a sheet of newspaper up and put that in the bottom of the deep litter box on top of the mesh as I was concerned that the mesh size being 1/4 inch might allow wasps in and perhaps some of the medium to fall out. I put wood chip in that was already breaking down and showing signs of supporting mycelium growth but the top surface of it appears to be relatively dry. That said, the colony in that hive were a shook swarm suffering from DWV in August and they have shown no real intent to thrive and sadly, I'm pretty sure they won't make it through winter.

I can't say what type of mycelium was taking hold but you could see the white root systems forming on the damp wood chip when I put them into the box.


Newspaper, cardboard, wool, coir, etc are all candidates, although some degree of durability is desirable, I think.

Scientifically speaking, it would be good to know what the mycelium is and to test it on bees, but until we get government funding, I guess it's going to be a 'suck it and see' approach! (Maybe not literally, though.)
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imkeer
Foraging Bee


Joined: 03 Oct 2011
Posts: 203
Location: Belgium, Antwerpen, Schilde

PostPosted: Sun Dec 07, 2014 4:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Paul Stamets also says that there must be a special reason why bees naturally live in rotting wood;
and they collect resin from the trees where these medicinal fungi grow...
Thanks for this interesting thread !

Luc P. (BE)
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Manuel Robert
Guard Bee


Joined: 04 Dec 2011
Posts: 73
Location: Bischofsheim, Rhön , Germany

PostPosted: Mon Dec 08, 2014 3:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

In Mycelium running and in one of his videos, Paul Stamets mentions a continuous stream of bees sucking on the mycelium of the garden giant mushroom, which is rather easy to grow on wood chips or shavings covered with a bit of earth. By the way these also seem to enhance the growth of certain vegetables. I have it growing between corn, cabbage and tomatoes.
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biobee
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Joined: 14 Jun 2007
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Location: UK, England, S. Devon

PostPosted: Thu Dec 11, 2014 11:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I already have a stack of rotting wood in each of my apiaries, mostly to provide habitat for other species, but maybe this should become a habit for all beekeepers for the reasons above, as well.
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ingo50
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Joined: 30 May 2014
Posts: 311
Location: Newport, Gwent, Wales, UK

PostPosted: Thu Dec 11, 2014 6:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you HowieNZ for posting the YouTube link. Excellent video , Ould highly recommend all members of this site to view.
I have put some rotting logs near my hives in my garden, so it will be interesting to see if any bees visit them. If I can get some of the fungi mentioned in the video, will try to seed the logs.
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HowieNZ
Nurse Bee


Joined: 18 May 2014
Posts: 33
Location: Dunedin, New Zealand

PostPosted: Thu Dec 11, 2014 6:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

No worries, pity in New Zealand we don't have the varieties mentioned however can but try local varieties.
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Che Guebuddha
Golden Bee


Joined: 31 Jan 2012
Posts: 1549
Location: Hårlev, Stevns Kommune, Denmark

PostPosted: Tue Mar 24, 2015 10:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am testing if bees prefer drinking Chaga tea and so far it looks promising. I placed a few chunks of chaga in a bowl with some water and already the next day the water was brown. Placed some dry grass too so bees dont drown. I have seen a few bees drinking it the other day. I could see them clearly flying from one particular hive and then flying back to it.

In this photo there is only one bee ready to fly off, I wasnt able to make a better photo with my phone. They sure are interested at this time to collect water from this chaga tea, algae, moss and from muddy areas. Will keep this bowl filled at all times and will observe throughout the season.

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Viggen
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Joined: 04 Jan 2010
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Location: USA, Arizona

PostPosted: Tue May 05, 2015 5:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My understanding is that Chaga grows on White Birch. On the older trees is where it would be found, generally higher up in the tree. And since Birch is short lived, maybe 30 years, that will give you some ideas.
As for drinking it yourself, great idea.
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