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Warré Woodworking

 
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Beeophyte
Guard Bee


Joined: 06 Oct 2011
Posts: 75
Location: Coastal Virginia, USA

PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2011 1:58 pm    Post subject: Warré Woodworking Reply with quote

Here is my Warré Hive so far. Built as close to the plans as I can. The top box is made from cedar and the bottom box is made from pine. All boards are 1" thick nominal, All things being equal I like building with Cedar better. But alas they are not equal. I can build three pine boxes for the price of one cedar. The screws are plated roberts drive screws which I am fond of for boatbuilding. The glue I use is Titebond II. It is cheap and waterproof. Screw heads will be filled with a mixture of Titebond II and sawdust.



Last edited by Beeophyte on Mon Oct 24, 2011 6:55 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Barbara
Site Admin


Joined: 27 Jul 2011
Posts: 1581
Location: England/Co.Durham/Ebchester

PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2011 2:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Jon

Good luck with your Warre. Unfortunately I'm not able to view your photo.
Might just be my old computer or more likely lack of user skills. It says photo not found when I click on link.

Regarding your poll in respect of cedar or pine I'm not sure what you are asking..... "Do we prefer pine or cedar?" or perhaps "Which of them are our hives made from?" I think most of us would agree that cedar would be the choice if all things were equal, but as you say they are not. Maybe I'm just a cheapskate but I would opt for pine because it's less expensive.

Commercial hives that I have previously bought have been cedar but hives that I have made myself have been pine because I don't have ready access to cedar and it is expensive. My current top bar hive is veneered MDF/chipboard/plywood. It started out in life as a corner cabinet which I acquired 2nd hand for free and after several years of use in my home it then got recycled this summer into a hive. The bees are really happy in it and are thriving. I love the fact that it cost me less than £5 to build because I used things I had lying around. It also looks the business! Smile

Will you populate your Warre with a swarm from your Lang, assuming they make it through the winter (fingers crossed) or chop and crop?

It will be interesting to see if the bees show a preference for one type of timber over the other.... ie which box they build in first.

Best wishes

Barbara
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Beeophyte
Guard Bee


Joined: 06 Oct 2011
Posts: 75
Location: Coastal Virginia, USA

PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2011 4:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I tried like the devil to get the pic uploaded here. On my own forum it works fine and it also shows up on the beesource forum but no joy here. I have hosted it on two different photobucket sites but neither seems to work here for me. Clearly I am doing something wrong.

If the Lang bees come through the winter season okay and build up strong during the first nectar flow I might try a hive split with my Warré next summer. Otherwise I will likely try to buy a nuc from a local beekeeper.

I love the cedar but I think Pine is more in keeping with Warré's quick and inexpensive ideas as outlined in his book.

I am curious what others think. I do have a good source of Cedar planks here up to 12" wide, knot free. A local sawmill that has been in business over 100 years. The old man that runs the place even helps me look through the boards for the best ones and cuts them to size free of cost. The cedar is beautiful, aromatic, and easy to work. It is also lighter than the pine, probably because it's been drying longer.

So I am fighting competing urges. One side of me wants to build beautiful cedar hives with nice box joints. The other side says that pine hives with butt joints are perfectly acceptable and in keeping with his (Abbe Warré) ideals.

Jon
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Barbara
Site Admin


Joined: 27 Jul 2011
Posts: 1581
Location: England/Co.Durham/Ebchester

PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2011 5:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you have a local supplier who is helpful like that, I would suggest you treat yourself to the cedar and if you can do beautiful box joints all the better. The hive will last you a lifetime and as you say, it smells wonderful.

Leave the pine for when you retire and start building more hives.

Only advice would be to cover the roof with something waterproof as a few people on here with cedar roofs are having problems keeping them watertight.

Regards

Barbara
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newwoman
Golden Bee


Joined: 19 Apr 2011
Posts: 1165
Location: UK/North East Wales

PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2011 6:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote


I think this is the photo you are looking for Barbara
Pat Very Happy
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Beeophyte
Guard Bee


Joined: 06 Oct 2011
Posts: 75
Location: Coastal Virginia, USA

PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2011 6:21 pm    Post subject: Thanks! Reply with quote

Thanks Pat what did I do wrong?
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newwoman
Golden Bee


Joined: 19 Apr 2011
Posts: 1165
Location: UK/North East Wales

PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2011 6:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Think it was the way the link was added- it did not all appear green on the posting and so would not click properly-I typed in the URL link rather than copy and paste it -if you hover your mouse over the URL tag at the top of your reply the correct 'code' appears along the top of the reply box-and then if you preview your message before you submit it you can 'see straight away' that it is all correct
Hope this is helpful
Pat Very Happy
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Beeophyte
Guard Bee


Joined: 06 Oct 2011
Posts: 75
Location: Coastal Virginia, USA

PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2011 6:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yup that did it, thanks!
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newwoman
Golden Bee


Joined: 19 Apr 2011
Posts: 1165
Location: UK/North East Wales

PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2011 7:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Brilliant-well done-the hive looks good too
Pat Laughing
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Barbara
Site Admin


Joined: 27 Jul 2011
Posts: 1581
Location: England/Co.Durham/Ebchester

PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2011 9:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi again Jon

Seeing the photo just confirms my view that if cedar is available and you can afford it, go for it. It just looks gorgeous! It's not like it's going to cost you hundreds of dollars to make it from cedar, which it would if you were buying a hive ready made.

Just my view.

Regards

Barbara

PS. Thanks Pat for sorting the photo. You are a star Wink
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Beeophyte
Guard Bee


Joined: 06 Oct 2011
Posts: 75
Location: Coastal Virginia, USA

PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2011 1:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the kind words Barbara and Pat. I think one of the things I like most about the Warré is that I don’t have to order much of anything from suppliers. I like knowing that I can build every single piece with stuff from the hardware store. I realize that a Langstroth could also be built with stuff from the hardware store but I doubt it would be cost effective to do so.

Funny when I see the photo I see where I neglected to clean up some glue that ran out here and there and other imperfections. I must of picked up a little OCD somewhere.

Something I failed to mention about the Cedar is it appears to be maybe a millimeter thicker than the pine. Both sides of the pine are planed and the cedar is rough on one side and smooth on the other. I kept to the internal dimensions on both boxes so the outside of the cedar box is ever so slightly bigger though it might line up if I sanded it down some. I decided to give the bees the smooth side of the cedar so the inside of the box is smooth and the outside is a little rough. I thought this might reduce propolis etc.

I think when I hive bees in these boxes they (the bees) will choose the box based on which is on top regardless of what the box is made of but we will know for sure next spring.

For those in cold climates cedar does offer a slightly higher insulation R-value (1.41 per inch) than pine (1.25 per inch). But that is assuming that both woods are cured to the same moisture content and currently at least that is not the case with my boxes. The pine box is definitely 'greener' than the cedar box. I am certain that my pine is not as insulative as its R-value would indicate because of the water still in the fibers.
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